tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post7587660054261320843..comments2024-01-02T16:09:57.364-07:00Comments on Intrepid Lutherans: A Little Touch of Marty In the Night! (#2)Intrepid Lutheranshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05867580862562801804noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-75631803051045258072011-11-14T19:36:11.758-07:002011-11-14T19:36:11.758-07:00Diana,
Entire long books have been written about...Diana, <br /><br />Entire long books have been written about the pure Gospel, i.e. the Gospel proclaimed in the Holy Scriptures and defined in our Lutheran confessions. One of the best is called simply, "Law and Gospel," by C.F.W. Walther. If you don't have it yet, I highly recommend you find it in Crosswalk's library and read through it, and then buy one for yourself. I think you will enjoy it. <br /><br />One of the best brief explanations of the Gospel is that given in Article IV of the Augsburg Confession: <br /><br />Article IV: Of Justification.<br /><br />1] Also they teach that men cannot be justified before God by their own strength, merits, or works, but are freely justified for 2] Christ's sake, through faith, when they believe that they are received into favor, and that their sins are forgiven for Christ's sake, who, by His death, has made satisfaction for our sins. 3] This faith God imputes for righteousness in His sight. (Rom. 3 and 4) <br /><br /><br />Pastor SpencerPastor Spencerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321516963313421661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-61040165524945063182011-11-14T19:26:18.357-07:002011-11-14T19:26:18.357-07:00Daniel,
I am not opposed per se to what you call...Daniel, <br /><br />I am not opposed per se to what you call the "Law-Gospel-Law" paradigm in preaching. To paraphrase Shakespeare, "The text is the thing!" If the text calls for it, the confessional Lutheran preacher can and should certainly follow up the proclamation of the Law and Gospel with directives to follow God's will in the treatment of our fellow man. And even if the text does not contain some specific guidance for our sanctified Christian lives, I believe it is permissible for the preacher to extrapolate such from the context, especially if he knows that a certain part of sanctification may be lacking in his congregation. <br /><br />But the point remains that what all sinners need most - from the preacher himself to all his hearers - is the stern condemnation of the Law, and the sweet comfort of the Gospel, Sunday after Sunday after Sunday after Sunday, until Jesus returns. If the sermon sometimes fails to address specific sanctification, either because it was not explicitly in the text, or because the preacher for whatever reason left it out, we will trust God the Holy Spirit to use the Gospel that was preached to motivate believers to do works of love. <br /><br />Pastor SpencerPastor Spencerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321516963313421661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-78654957194306911212011-11-14T19:10:40.430-07:002011-11-14T19:10:40.430-07:00I will respectfully accept your response to not id...I will respectfully accept your response to not identify the subject. CrossWalk is a Lutheran Church, not a "church group," so maybe it's a different entity that falls under similar circumstances. <br /><br />Regardless, it is obviously quite concerning to have a group of theologians draw such a strong conclusion involving doctrine, no matter where it is occurring. Could you explain what the "pure Gospel" is, in accordance with Confessional Lutheranism? <br /><br />I don't know if such a question requires an in-depth response or a brief one, I'll let the theologians decide that, if you are so inclined! <br /><br />Thank you,<br />Diana BergerAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-76397619672409829572011-11-14T16:59:24.679-07:002011-11-14T16:59:24.679-07:00Diana,
Thank you for your comment.
I will resp...Diana, <br /><br />Thank you for your comment. <br /><br />I will respectfully decline to identify the reference in this forum since that was not the point of the post. My point was that all Pastors - myself included - need to work very diligently to be sure to present the pure Gospel in our sermons, and that this is the message that predominates; not law and not sanctification, as important as those both are also. Wherever that is not done, there needs to be a change and improvement in the preaching.<br /><br />Glad to have you as a regular reader. <br /><br />Pastor SpencerPastor Spencerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321516963313421661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-62693200924766628662011-11-14T16:30:59.205-07:002011-11-14T16:30:59.205-07:00Pr. Spencer,
My father and I had a discussion in...Pr. Spencer, <br /><br />My father and I had a discussion in the not-too-distant past wherein I parroted the line that "sermons should not be Law-Gospel-Law," at which he offered a response that caused me to pause and reconsider my position. He pointed out that while nearly all of the Epistles are loaded with examples of man's depravity followed by the richness of the Holy Gospel, the Gospel is also followed by instructions regarding how we can imitate Christ's righteousness - indeed, make use of that righteousness that actually has become ours in Holy Baptism - by serving one another in love. I am curious what your response to this would be, and if you disapprove of this sort of preachment of love-to-neighbor following the proclamation of the Gospel in homiletic practice.Daniel Bakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02167233773588648850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-18286833454981113762011-11-14T12:45:20.809-07:002011-11-14T12:45:20.809-07:00Pastor Spencer,
Always find your blog very intere...Pastor Spencer,<br /><br />Always find your blog very interesting and thought provoking. If I might be so bold, is this post referring to CrossWalk Church in Phoenix, Arizona and the adhoc committee report that was given at the conference in Las Vegas recently? <br /><br />I have hesitated to inquire like this on past posts, where it also seems like you and your friends are referring to CrossWalk, as I am not a theologian, nor do I have time to spend on these blogs. I am, however, a member of CrossWalk, who in my spare time, tries to understand some of the underlying concerns that are out there.<br /><br />Thank you,<br />Diana BergerAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-21849188130604186342011-11-13T15:49:55.088-07:002011-11-13T15:49:55.088-07:00Thank you for your comment, Mitch. And you too, Da...Thank you for your comment, Mitch. And you too, Daniel. <br /><br />Next to the "mostly application (sanctification) most of the time" sermons, another very frequent commodity in our midst is what you call the "story-time" sermon. At a conference some years back another Pastor and I recounted at least 30 "illustrations" or stories from the sermon preached at the worship service. The text itself was barely mentioned, and the so-called sermon was little more than a long series of these anecdotes strung together with some spiritual "lessons" thrown in. And this was done by a Pastor who at the time was considered one of the best preachers in our synod. A re-emphasis and resurgence of good, old-fashioned confessional Lutheran preaching is needed today. <br /><br />Pastor SpencerPastor Spencerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321516963313421661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-61753177568786482912011-11-13T15:25:04.301-07:002011-11-13T15:25:04.301-07:00In C.F.W. Walther's "Law and Gospel"...In C.F.W. Walther's "Law and Gospel" I'm pretty sure he says that some of the best preachers are recent converts or men who have experienced the agony of the Law and the sweetness of the Gospel in a real time situation. I find that observation very true. I see pastors who have been born into the faith and have been "good" all their life and they don't preach very good sermons. But very recently I went to a church where a Vicar, who was confirmed in his 20's, preached. Prior to that he was a pretty big partier. His sermon, in my opinion, really applied to the congregation -- people who are out in the real world that commit and/or are around real time sins -- sins that even pagan society would deem unacceptable. He really preached the Law in its full severity. There wasn't any dancing around the Law. It was a very good "you" sermon with applicable sins -- not just a Law of original sin. But after condemning us with the Law he swiftly showered us with the Gospel. Far too often I hear sermons that are presented as, I like to call, story time. Their illustrations predominate and it's very hard to pick out Law and Gospel. I can't imagine how hard it would be for a visitor to hear the Law and Gospel if a member can barely do it. <br /><br />Mitch ForteAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-36221097997934121502011-11-13T14:34:59.884-07:002011-11-13T14:34:59.884-07:00The sermon at my home parish last week was focused...The sermon at my home parish last week was focused on the fact that faith isn't simply head-knowledge. Pastor even made sure to point out that, during the hymn "The Ten Commandments are the Law," we would be singing all 12 verses because it is in the last verses that the purpose of the Law is shown ("God these commandments gave therein to show, O child of man, your sin" and "Our works cannot salvation gain; They merit but endless pain.") and the truth of the Gospel is given ("Help us, Lord Jesus Christ, for we a Mediator have in Thee."). <br /><br />Suffice it to say I have had a lot to be thankful for in the sermons I have heard over the past month (not just at my home parish either!). Must be something in the water over here. :)Daniel Bakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02167233773588648850noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-60909223997025651952011-11-13T07:23:36.796-07:002011-11-13T07:23:36.796-07:00Thank you for the comment, Joe. Good observation.
...Thank you for the comment, Joe. Good observation.<br /><br />Of course, the Law is not popular - it's not supposed to be! I've noticed, however, that in many of the "contempo" services I've listened to, the "messages" are very often actually loaded down with law. But it is more often than not, the 3rd use of the law rather than the first or second. This is a major problem. It's as if the preacher skips over the actual exposition of Scripture, and just gives 30 or 40 minutes of "application" and "appropriation." In other words, there is often very little of what we have done to necessitate a Savior, and what God has done to provide that Savior, but a whole lot of what we should do to show that we are saved. In this way, the preaching is much more sectarian/Reformed/Arminian than it is confessional Lutheran. As a brother Pastor recently commented to me, ". . . we have perhaps downplayed the role of faith. More seriously, I think, we have downplayed the role of repentance as a key and essential component of faith--effectively reducing faith to mere head knowledge." Thus, a sermon without at least one of the first two uses of the law is missing a key element that was quite prominent in the preaching of Jesus, His Apostles, and the Reformers. <br /><br />Pastor SpencerPastor Spencerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01321516963313421661noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-39901104171463540492011-11-13T06:52:24.213-07:002011-11-13T06:52:24.213-07:00I don't know about the rest of you...but I nee...I don't know about the rest of you...but I need to hear that law a lot to drive me back to Christ. It is so easy to think that there is any good in us. I have heard too many sermons that say we are no longer under the law. But in a sense we still are. A warped view of justification tips the scales towards complacency and a view that we are all good people...<br /><br />JoeJoe Krohnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08675123326627773329noreply@blogger.com