tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post5887923127098761879..comments2024-01-02T16:09:57.364-07:00Comments on Intrepid Lutherans: Johann Gerhard on Romans 5:19Intrepid Lutheranshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05867580862562801804noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-90421975402374794822012-11-12T21:33:39.732-07:002012-11-12T21:33:39.732-07:00Seems there was a similar blog post elsewhere that...Seems there was a similar blog post elsewhere that inferred that there is a contradiction regarding this passage and Luther was used against this 'contradiction'. You should take Luther's advice and not dwell on the many and all. It is about sin and grace. To say there is a contradiction puts the universal redemption of all men and the reconciliation of all sins into question. Do you really want to do this?Joe Krohnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08675123326627773329noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-50052519840822922802012-11-12T19:13:39.478-07:002012-11-12T19:13:39.478-07:00What a great point you brought up Mr. Lindee. I wa...What a great point you brought up Mr. Lindee. I was re-reading Chemnitz' loci on justification today and he was making the same exact point. Christian Schulzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01148768974732438954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-78955260599472718572012-11-12T12:47:19.969-07:002012-11-12T12:47:19.969-07:00Following on from A.Berean's comment (what'...Following on from A.Berean's comment (what's your name again Mr. Berean?), I took up Luther's <i>Commentary on Romans</i> (tr. J. Theodore Muellor, 1954, Zondervan) a couple weeks ago, after Rev. Rydecki started publishing these excerpts from Gerhard's commentary on Romans, and have found myself delighted by it. He explains these scriptures in ways that I've not heard contemporary Lutherans speak. For example, in Ch. 3, he compares justification with its opposite, judgment. Those who face judgment are the opposite of justified. In Luther's comparison, he was explaining how it is that God could be "justified in His sayings" (v.4), when unrighteous man is in no position to either judge or justify a perfectly righteous God. He explains: <br /><br />"But God is justified in His sayings when His Word is recognized and accepted by us as just and truthful. This takes place when we believe His Word. Conversely, God is judged in His sayings if men regard His Word as false and fallacious... If God is justified in His sayings, it is really we (<i>the believers</i>) who are justified; if He is judged and condemned, it is they (<i>the unbelievers</i>) who are judged and condemned according to Mark 16:16: '<i>He that believeth not shall be damned</i>'" (pg. 51). <br /><br />It is illuminating to consider the impact of justification in terms of its opposite, <i>judgment</i> or <i>condemnation</i>. The Scriptures tell us that the wicked are "judged already": <i>He that <b>believeth</b> on him is <b>not condemned</b>: but he that <b>believeth not</b> is <b>condemned already</b>, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.</i> (John 3:18).<br /><br />That is:<br /><br />Faith = no condemnation, or no judgment = (justification)<br />Unbelief = condemnation, or judgment = (no justification)<br /><br />Is it possible that the condemned are also "justified"? No. Justification and judgment cannot be commingled. They are opposites. As a result:<br /><br /><b>-</b> It is impossible for those with righteous standing before God to face condemnation: <i>justified</i> and <i>condemned</i> are opposites. <br /><br /><b>-</b> It is impossible for one who is justified before God to also be judged by God: <i>justification</i> and <i>judgment</i> are opposites.<br /><br />This is especially the case for those who stand BEFORE GOD in the perfect righteousness of Jesus Christ – those so justified cannot also be condemned, unless God Himself, on the basis of His Righteousness, be subject to condemnation along with them (which is also "absurd"). It seems to me, given the mutually exclusive nature of <i>justification</i> and <i>judgment</i> as Luther exposes it, that <i>those who are condemned by God through unbelief, cannot at the same time be justified before Him in any sense.</i><br /><br />Regarding Ch. 5:18-19, Luther, writing rather straightforwardly, concurs with Gerhard: <br /><br />"<i>As by the offense of one judgment cam upon all men to condemnation</i> (v.18). Here the apostle says "all"; first, because as all who are begotten of Adam are born again through (<i>faith in</i>) Christ; and secondly, because as there is no carnal begetting except through Adam, so also there is no spiritual begetting except through Christ. <br /><br />"<i>As by on man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous</i> (v.19). Here the Apostle speaks of "many" and not of "all," to show that in the preceding verse his emphasis is not on the number of the sinners of the righteous, but upon the power of sin and grace. If sin proved itself so powerful that a single transgression has perverted many, or rather all, then divine grace is much more powerful; for the one act of grace, (<i>Christ's atonement</i>) can save many, all men, of many sins, if they only would desire it ['desire it' through faith, of course, instead of reject it in unbelief -DL]" (pp. 81-82).Mr. Douglas Lindeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08326973217859277204noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-88080445500323721402012-11-12T08:53:59.045-07:002012-11-12T08:53:59.045-07:00If one is familiar with historical, confessional l...If one is familiar with historical, confessional lutheranism (The Book of Concord, Luther, Chemnitz) he will realize that this interpretation by Gerhard is very consistent with how Romans 5:19 is understood. The Formula of Concord only uses Romans 5:19 to demonstrate the meritorious cause of justification, not the extent. Luther addresses it in his Commentary on Romans and his Works, Lectures on Romans. Chemnitz addresses it in his Loci Theologici and Ministry, Word, and Sacraments. Historically, there is a change in the use of this passage.<br /><br />This is a very fine work by Rev. Rydecki and he should be thanked for all of his hard work. I hope that these translations will one day be published for public consumption. I would add it to my shelf.A. Bereanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16174087389759354109noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6881617320676906596.post-40130364813531868392012-11-12T04:17:27.800-07:002012-11-12T04:17:27.800-07:00Gerhard said something was absurd - what is this a...Gerhard said something was absurd - what is this absurdity?<br /><br />It is this...<br /><i>Likewise, one could infer that the righteousness of Christ is propagated to all men together, <b>without any regard for faith or unbelief, since the sin of Adam is propagated to all through carnal generation</b>. </i><br /><br />But this is UOJ. Hunnius said the same thing. The theory that the righteousness of Christ is imputed to the whole world by virtue of Jesus resurrection from the dead, without any regard for faith is absurd.<br /><br />Here we now have Gerhard and Hunnius saying the same thing, that is now on top of Scripture, two additional witnesses countering the Huberian opinion.<br /><br />LPCLPChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11352627830833515548noreply@blogger.com